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What is your fuel mileage?

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tsunami View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote tsunami Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:07pm
A common mistake people make is to equate octane with energy content.  Octane signifies how readily the gasoline ignites and a higher number reduces engine 'knock'.  The energy content depends on the concentration of ethanol in the gas.
Non-ethanol gas with an octane rating of 87 has more energy in each gallon than 87 octane (5-15%) ethanol gasoline.  So if you can...buy 87 octane non-ethanol for a better buy.  But most (but not all) 87 octane gas sold in the US now has ethanol in it.  Gasohol (85% ethanol) will give you about 20-30% lower mpg because it has about that much lower energy content.  If you have a 'flex-fuel' vehicle that can burn gasohol...the price has to be at least 20-30% lower than ethanol gas to justify the lower mpg you will get.
91 octane gasoline typically is non-ethanol...so it reduces potential engine knock but also improves mpg by generating more energy. However, if the price is more than 5-15% higher than ethanol, you will not get better mileage for the money.  Then, the only reason to buy it is because you have an older vehicle whose engine cannot automatically adjust itself to use lower octane gas.

Diesel fuel actually has a slightly lower energy content than gasoline.  However, the high compression in the diesel engine gives it a higher efficiency...and thus more mpg.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ratdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Oct 2012 at 12:28pm

Here's a site with a list, by state, of stations that sell non-ethanol gasoline:

http://pure-gas.org/

Tsunami - You say that 91 gas is typically non-ethanol. I've never seen it in any of my travels at typical general service gas stations, only at specialty places that are off the beaten track. Where have you found it? What brands?

When we lived in MN, it was a violation of state law to sell non-oxygenated gasoline (in any octane, I believe) for any vehicle use other than vintage vehicles and small gas engines (ATV's, boats, etc).

-- Steve


Steve, Anne, and Paige the Rat Terrier
2013 Lexus RX 450h Hybrid AWD
2011 RP-177 (aka: The Circus Wagon)
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tsunami View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tsunami Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 2012 at 10:42am
In the upper mid-west, 91 octane non-ethanol is quite common at the larger (volume sales) gas stations.  Especially if the station is located near any lakes.  Most boat motors and ATVs do not run well using ethanol.  I have the repair receipts to prove it.
In MN, the 91 octane pumps state that the gas is for boats, ATVs and older vehicles that require 91 octane.  I always assumed that the pump sticker would display a warning if it were illegal to put in a regular vehicle.  The much higher price is almost always more than 15% higher than ethanol,
so you would not gain any extra mileage/price advantage by buying the more expensive gas.
A gas station near my home has a pump dedicated to 'farm' use...that is, the price does not include
any 'highway' taxes...it has  a large warning sticker warning about fines that would be levied if you put the 'lower cost' gas in your car.  Yet, next to that pump is a 91 octane pump and its sticker does not warn you that it is illegal to put it in your regular car.  I would assume that you could put it in a 87-octane car if your car's computer was having a problem controlling knock.
Farm States tend to force drivers to use ethanol gas to subsidize mega-farms that feed corn to ethanol plants. MN is talking about raising the 10% ethanol level to 15-20%...even tho' car manufacturers have stated that using that high a level of ethanol in their non-flex-fuel vehicles would void their warranties.
That level of ethanol would almost assure destruction of older lawn mowers, chain saws, cars, etc.
No repairs...but forced replacement.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ratdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 2012 at 2:15pm

We moved from Florida to Minnesota in 2005 and just moved back to Florida this year. My wife has a  car that ran fine in FL (where Ethanol wasn't added to gas until 2010). When we moved to MN, she put the car in storage for 6 months every winter. At the end of the first 2 winters when we got the car out of storage, the injectors were gummed up so bad the car wouldn't run. Big expense. MN was already adding Ethanol to the gas when we got up there so that's what she bought. Her mechanic told her where to find non-ethanol gas in nearby town. That's where she started buying gas and she never had another problem over the next 5 winters. It didn't matter how much more expensive the non-ethanol gas was because it was cheaper than rebuilding fuel injectors every year.

 
You're right, small motors don't like ethanol either. And it's not good to let ethanol sit in your tank, fuel lines, injectors, or carburetors. My experience is that ethanol gas doesn't have a very long shelf life. That's why my wife's car had problems . . . the gas sat in there all winter.
 
I have a an old mid-60's muscle car with its original engine. This car was built before ethanol gas came on the market so it was designed to run on non-ethanol. I don't know what gas was used in it between the time ethanol came on the market and when I bought it but I suspect ethanol because the fuel line was gummed up and had to be replaced and the carburetor was also gummed up and had to be rebuilt. I've only used non-ethanol in the car since that work was done and haven't had any more problems.
 
Haven't tried non-ethanol in my tow vehicle yet but I'm thinking of giving it a try to see if I can squeeze out a few more mpg.

I realize all of this is anecdotal, but it's all the convincing I need that non-ethanol is a better choice than ethanol. I recently signed a petition to change the law here in Florida to allow non-ethanol gasoline to be sold at all stations.

 
-- Steve
 

Steve, Anne, and Paige the Rat Terrier
2013 Lexus RX 450h Hybrid AWD
2011 RP-177 (aka: The Circus Wagon)
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tsunami View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tsunami Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 2012 at 7:01pm
Re: my ATVs.  I used to buy the cheapest 87 octane gas for them, even if the gas was ethanol.
They would sit most of time during the winter...even tho' I put some 'Stabil" tm stabilizer in them.
During the last summer, I had to have all three have their carbs/injectors cleaned for a considerable amount of money.
The repair shop told me that as stations keep raising the ethanol level in their gas...the shop has had increasing repairs to clean out gummed machines.  I was told only to put 91 octane non-ethanol in them.  An annual $300 repair job more than justifies using more expensive non-ethanol.
Most cars use up any 'old' ethanol gas in their tanks quite quickly.  My Toyota dealer told me that
I really needed to use up all of the gas in my cars at least monthly.  That is, if your tank holds 15 gallons...make sure that you drive enough to have to add another 15 gallons.  To freshen up the older gas that could potentially start to develop gummy deposits.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drhalvey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2015 at 7:27am
I am towing a 2010 175 POD with a 2014 Grand Caravan.  At 60-65 MPH she makes 11-14 MPG (depending on the head wind). The lower gas prices helps take the bite out of the pump.  Eh?  POD ON!
Respectfully,
Southwest Kansas R-Pod 2010
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1shadowsabre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 6:17pm
With my 2002 tundra I was lucky to get 12 mpg. We will be leaving on a trip in a week or so and I will be towing my r pod 171 with my brand new Ram 1500 ecodiesel. I will post an update when we get back.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1shadowsabre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Sep 2015 at 11:49am
We made it back from a 650 mile trip with our r pod 171 towing behind our brand new Ram 1500 ecodiesel. Averaged 19 mpg on the whole trip with about  15 mpg while towing. I was able to set the cruise control and the Ram never felt like it was working.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote J&J fl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 2016 at 4:47pm
Pulling with f-150 5.4 V8 171 .heading home from Everglades to Orlando and got 16 MPG. That was best ever. Tail wind and doing 65 MPH. I checked calculations 3 time . have been getting 12 mpg doing 70 mph.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dickaye Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jun 2016 at 10:49pm
I have a 1999 Chevy Silverado 1/2 ton gas two door white pickup truck pulling a 2014 
R-POD 177 that I purchased used from a R-Pod dealer about two months ago.  With a full two week camping trip load, I averaged 15.9 MPG from Utah to Oregon and back.  Now I am a little rusty on the memory thing.  Being so, I might have averaged 14.9 MPG or even 13.9 or 12.9, but I am certain it was something point nine.  Point nine anything is not bad, but while I am here, I want to say this little trailer has really made an impression on my little wife of 42 years(or was it 43 years?).  She was not too happy about the boat or the gun collection or the ham radio, but she really loves the R-Pod camping trailer.  So, since I am now in her good graces, I have decided to join this here forum and share some of my experiences.  This is my very first post so I hope I haven't stepped over any lines or something.
"You can lead a horse to water, but a pencil must be lead" Stan Laurel 1932
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