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Microwave/Convection Fire Hazard??

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TXBoondocker1217 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 25 Sep 2009 at 7:43pm

Background:  After reading and surfing, I decided it was time to try out the Convection part of the oven (I had used the microwave side several times, with no troule.  Got my biscuits, pan and the generator.  Started the Generator (4500 for those that are wondering, Did what the book said and hit start...had a racket like a fan beating on something, turned it off, cleared every thing and did it again, same thing, so I let it run to see if I could locate what was happening, oven got quite and the table goes round and round and element is heating, then I hear something kick on, and the racket started again, this time...several seconds and it trips the breaker.  Call husband (I don't do electrical) and he resets the breaker and started it again, same thing, the breaker trips.  OK, I got a warranty on this thing, so call Tyler RV Center, and they say bring it in.  Take the Pod to dealer and guess what, yep, it ran without noise and no tripping.  With 4 adults standing in my little R-Pod, 90* with no ac, we all look at converter box and whoa, they have a 20 amp appliance on a 15 amp breaker.  None of the 4 of us know anything about Convection Ovens, and seems like this one is cycling microwave one time and then the convection the next moment.  It has 'PH' flashing one sec and then 40 0F the next.  Well I left it with them and they let it run to see what would happen, 1 hour and 15 min. later, it said it was ready to cook the biscuits, dealer called and today heard from Forrest River.  FR is sending a new Micro/Convection and  my dealer is rewiring with a 20 amp breaker.  He has 4 more on the lot and said he will probably rewire those also if they are the same.

I do not really know if this is a fire hazard, but it did not seem like the thing to do...so wanted to let everyone know to check their breakers.  Also, this pod came off the assembly line the first part of August. 
Steve & Carole
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HuronSailor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Sep 2009 at 2:36am

Last time our convection oven was in use, the refrigerator, which was on 110V at the time, started making a rapid clicking noise coming from the area of the outside control panel, but both fridge and oven continued to work fine as far as we could tell. I had forgotten about that until now. Maybe more investigation is called for, could be another project.

Hopefully your dealer will actually "rewire" if needed. A 20A circuit requires 12GA wire.
 
Thanks for sharing this.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Outbound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Sep 2009 at 3:53am
You were running the microwave/convection oven off of a generator?  Does your genny produce a pure sine wave, or is it modified?  Some electronics have trouble with modified sine...  Perhaps someone who has used a generator to power their pod can chime in with their experience.

As far as the 15 amp vs 20 amp breaker, there is no danger if a 15 amp breaker is in place.   If more than 15 amps is drawn, the breaker will throw.  Sure, your biscuits may remain uncooked, but it won't start a fire.

Besides, the microwave is 1000 watts and the convection is (I think) 1500 watts.  A 15 amp circuit has 1800 watts available - more than enough to run the unit.

As HuronSailor said, make sure that 12 gauge wire is used if they switch your breaker to 20 amp.  Otherwise, this may very well cause a dangerous situation.


-edit-

In retrospect, that bit I said about "no danger" is wrong.  A breaker is a fail-safe only.  The wiring should always be suitably sized for the load.  Having a breaker in place is no excuse for doing something that could/would otherwise be unsafe.

That said, in this specific case, I still say that a 15 amp circuit is adequate for the r-pod's microwave.
Craig :: 2008 Mazda Tribute :: 2009 r-pod 171, The Johnnie Ray
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote techntrek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Sep 2009 at 10:18am
Certainly shouldn't have been a problem running anything in the 'pod from a 4500 watt genny.  Boondocker, did you try to run other stuff that you know is working right - like the A/C, or a TV from the house, from the genset?
 
Generators by their nature should be sine wave, modified sine wave is usually from cheap inverters.  You might get a dirty sine wave depending on the load, but the load is modifying the wave and not the other way around.  Induction loads (like motors) are notorious for this - and the transformer inside a microwave would do it, too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TXBoondocker1217 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Sep 2009 at 5:28pm

OK, like I said I don't do electricity...just like to have it when I need it. Wink  The first thing I did when we saw that the breaker kept throwing, was to see if anything else was having problems, TV, A/C.  No problems...talked with my son-in-law and he said the breaker was probably overheated and that was why it would not turn back on.  Have not talked with him since they decided to rewire, but do remember that he said that they would have to rewire with 12 guage wire. 

Maybe I should have not used the "Fire Hazard??", don't know anything about sine wave, except that my son-in-law talks about it every time I ask him a question.  (He is a Certified Master Electrician)I just wanted to alert ya'll in case it is a problem for someone else...
 
Outbound, If you will read your instruction book for the Microwave/Convection Oven, you will see that it requires a 20 amp....that is where my dealer came up with changing the wiring...don't know if FR is picking up the tab or not, but dealer would not start  until they heard from FR...when they did, they said that they would rewire... 
 
Thanks for the replies
Steve & Carole
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Outbound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 4:03am
"Modified" was a poor choice of words on my part.  "Distorted" or "Dirty" would be better.

Looking at the specs of a Honda EU1000iA, you'll see that it uses a digital inverter to provide "reliable power to computers and other sensitive equipment."

Yamaha also uses inverter technology and states "You can use this generator with confidence as a power source for appliances with built-in computer functions or for microcomputer-controlled power tools."
Craig :: 2008 Mazda Tribute :: 2009 r-pod 171, The Johnnie Ray
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HuronSailor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 10:20am
Just checked my user's manual for the Sylvania SC-11100 Microwave/Convection oven. Page 4 states that the unit requires a 20A circuit, yet on page 7 it lists power consumption as follows: 1450W (microwave), 1350 (convection), 1350 ( top & bottom grill), 850 (top grill).
 
So if the power consumption figures are correct, the 15A breaker should be adequate, as Outbound stated, even though it's being pushed to about 80% capacity. Maybe that's too close to the edge?
 
I've left a voice mail for Susan Thornberg, the warranty manager at FR.  I'll keep you all posted if and when I talk to her.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tusten Traveler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 11:24am
Mine makes that horrible grinding bone crunching noise intermittently even when using it as a plain microwave and while hooked to shore power. I'll be looking for any answers here, but I'm already wishing I had skipped the convection option and bought a cheaper version.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David and Danette Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 11:44am
      I was going to cancel my appointment for the corners to be sealed with camping world. I am thinking twice now , it may be best to keep appointment and have the microwave checked out instead. I will ask at camping world to look at these posts and have them decide what to do. There is still a lot of good things to think about with this poor trailer, it is just getting a bad start in life.       Smile     David and Danette
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Outbound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 12:02pm
Originally posted by rpodcamper.com rpodcamper.com wrote:

WHAT ELSE COULD GO WRONG WITH THIS THING????????

I'm sorry that you've been having problems.  I hope that between FR and your dealer that everything will be set right.

I've used the micro/convection quite a bit with no problem at all.  In the convection oven, I've baked muffins and I've roasted a (small) chicken and everything in-between.  I've used the microwave for general thawing and heating, cooking potatoes, corn on the cob and popping popcorn.  I would gladly have the unit in my house.


Originally posted by HuronSailor HuronSailor wrote:

I've left a voice mail for Susan Thornberg, the warranty manager at FR.  I'll keep you all posted if and when I talk to her.

Thanks for taking concrete action.  I'll be interested to hear what FR has  to say.


As I re-read this thread, two things did occur to me:
1) Like most TTs, the r-pod has a 30 amp feed.  If the micro/convection ends up with a 20 amp breaker, there technically isn't enough power left over for the air conditioner.
2) Campground electricity is notorious for voltage fluctuations, particularly undervolts.  I wouldn't be surprised to see the voltage dipping below 110v, and I foresee problems running a 1450w microwave on a 15 amp circuit at 110v.

Craig :: 2008 Mazda Tribute :: 2009 r-pod 171, The Johnnie Ray
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